Plakias Forums
Ostraco's Bar => Gossip => Topic started by: Graham_and_Karen on March 27, 2008, 12:32:34 PM
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Not directly to do with Plakias but I'd appreciate forum members' thoughts on small, lightweight digital cameras.
Specifically, I'm thinking of buying a Pentax Optio S10 and was wondering whether any forum members already had this camera. If so, I'd appreciate hearing what you think of it.
At 10MPix. it's more than I think I need (7MPix. would be enough for our 'snaps') but it's small, lightweight and at around £130, just within my budget.
The other camera that I'm considering as an alternative is the Olympus FE280 (aka C520) so experiences with that would also be useful.
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Not directly to do with Plakias but I'd appreciate forum members' thoughts on small, lightweight digital cameras.
This thread could go on............. and on
For some years I've been bringing a relatively heavyweight, fairly sophisticated digital camera (Olympus C-765 with 10x zoom lens). Nothing compared with Chris (Harribobs) beautiful Camera set up which requires a trailer on the back of his hire car
I longed for a lightweight and recently acquired a Canon IXUS 70 (7.1 megapixels) and find the photo quality - particularly the colour rendering to be vastly superior to my (once) much more expensive Olympus and I now don't bother with my Olympus unless I am certain I will need it's 10x zoom capability. The Canon is very small indeed and I am very pleased indeed with it. It should be obtainable for about £130. It has both viewfinder and a VERY good LCD screen.
John R
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Yes this thread could go on and on, I love talking about gadgets
For starters Graham you can check out review sites, here are a couple:
DPReview (http://www.dpreview.com/)
Steves Digicams (http://www.steves-digicams.com/)
In the past I have favoured Canon point and shoot compact cameras for their generally superior image quality. However these days it is much more of a level playing field.
There are a number of factors that will determine what you end up with, i.e how many pixels, how much optical zoom, do you need manual controls, good movie mode etc etc. Oh yes and price of course!
Another thing to consider is usage. Will it be a general snapshot camera? Will you be taking lovely panoramics of Plakias? If so then you might want to look for a camera whose lens starts quite 'wide'. Most compacts (including the S10) tend to start at around 38mm which is not too wide and wont allow you to squeeze in a lot of that scenery. Look here for a comparison of Focal Lengths. (http://www.tamron.com/lenses/learning_center/tools/focal-length-comparison.php)
If you do want to go 'wider' then Panasonic make quite a range of cameras that start at 28mm including some well regarded 'super-zooms'.
Once you have narrowed it down to a couple of models you can start bargain hunting. For example you can get the Pentax S10 for £106 delivered from Pixmania via Amazon.
Another option is to buy a refurbished camera, my last couple of compacts have been refurbs off eBay and I have had no problems with them. In some ways it can be seen as safer as every refurb that goes out the door has been through the full QC which is not always the case for new models.
Cheers,
Paul
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So far so good - I was hoping my question might generate some interest. I'd already studied the review sites and, if it were down to me I'd probably go with a Canon IXUS or a Sony Cybershot but it's actually going to be Karen's camera so weight, size and feel have been significant in narrowing down the choice. Your point about focal length is a good one Paul - 38mm is not ideal - I'll certainly go to the comparison site. Karen would like more than x3 optical zoom but unless you are using a tripod, I'm not sure it would be that much of an advantage. The Pentax Optio Z10 has x7 optical zoom but it's a few mm too large for Karen's liking.
One of the things I've considered important is the time from switch on to first shot and the time between shots - most of our photos are taken with little preparation and taking a couple of similar shots of the same thing so we can choose the best.
It's incredible how many different models there are to choose from - even from one manufacturer. Comet and the like have a fairly limited range. We're off to Jessops at the weekend for more 'hands-on'. As for price - I've bought from Pixmania before and been happy.
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A lot of compacts are 3x zooms but there are more and more 4/5/6 & 7 ones coming out. Then there is the super-zoom cameras with 10/15/18 times zooms but these tend to be a lot less pocketable.
There are a couple of trade-offs with larger zoom ranges. One is that optical quality tends to suffer, especially at either extreme of the zoom range. Another point as you alluded to is that as the focal length increases so does the need for a higher shutter speed to eliminate camera shake and the blurry image it causes. In bright sunny weather outdoors you should be ok even with the longest zooms, but with less light available you may need to use a tripod. An alternative would be to get a camera with image stabilization which helps to eliminate camera shake. I have it on a couple of my SLR lenses and it really works well.
I like the look of the Canon IXUS 950 IS but it may be a little more than you want to spend. Can get it for £167 off eBay.
Another option is the IXUS 75 currently £109 at Tesco Direct.
or how about the Panasonic FX12 for £95 at Play.
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Another option is the IXUS 75 currently £109 at Tesco Direct.
That is an excellent buy. These cameras seem to have all the + qualities mentioned in discussions so far. My 70 has the same workings and it is quick to switch on, quick between photos, long battery life. Stores 600 high quality photos on an inexpensive 2gb SD card. The wide angle is a true 5.8mm which equates to 26mm in 35 mm photography terminoligy. Anyway you seem to have the idea about narrowing things down so keep looking - my opinions are biased on a my purchase with which I am very satisfied. I did very little research and did an impulse buy at an airport shop !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
John R
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Camera Price Buster (http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/cat9.html)
is a great website for finding good prices on cameras, lenses, accessories etc.
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DPReview has a handy side by side camparitor (is that a word?)
Here is a comparison of the Canon IXUS 75 (SD750) vs Pentax S10 vs Olympus FE280 (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=canon_sd750%2Cpentax_optios10%2Coly_fe280&show=all)
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Another option is the IXUS 75 currently £109 at Tesco Direct.
Also don't forget to use Quidco for a further 3% off and also Tesco are offering Triple clubcard points for the next couple of weeks. That brings the effective price down towards the hundred mark.
Yes I really am a bargain nut (though in reality it just means I end up buying a load of crap I don't really need )
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Another option is the IXUS 75 currently £109 at Tesco Direct.
Also don't forget to use Quidco for a further 3% off and also Tesco are offering Triple clubcard points for the next couple of weeks. That brings the effective price down towards the hundred mark.
Yes I really am a bargain nut (though in reality it just means I end up buying a load of crap I don't really need )
When I looked today, the IXUS 75 was not on the Tesco Direct site - they only had the IXUS 70 at £119
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When I looked today, the IXUS 75 was not on the Tesco Direct site - they only had the IXUS 70 at £119
I prefer my 70 over the 75. The 75 might have a slightly larger screen but does not have a viewfinder. The works are otherwise identical. I had the choice between 75 and 70 and chose the 70. They also both have the same very small footprint indeed.
John R
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When I looked today, the IXUS 75 was not on the Tesco Direct site - they only had the IXUS 70 at £119
Yes looks like that offer is now over. Discontinued here. (http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.200-3656.aspx)
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DPReview has a handy side by side camparitor (is that a word?)
Here is a comparison of the Canon IXUS 75 (SD750) vs Pentax S10 vs Olympus FE280 ([url]http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=canon_sd750%2Cpentax_optios10%2Coly_fe280&show=all[/url])
Thanks Paul - I'd used that site for other comparisons. Very useful. I know Karen also likes rounded corners as on the Olympus - more comfortable in your pocket. My influence on the decision has to be very subtle otherwise she will think I'm getting the camera for myself. I'll probably know after the weekend which one she wants.
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When I looked today, the IXUS 75 was not on the Tesco Direct site - they only had the IXUS 70 at £119
You could snap this up IXUS 70 + Printer (http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.202-4135.aspx)
for £99 which is less than the camera on its own! Can't imagine stock will last long.
EDIT: Use TDX-CLHD voucher for £5 off
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When I looked today, the IXUS 75 was not on the Tesco Direct site - they only had the IXUS 70 at £119
You could snap this up IXUS 70 + Printer ([url]http://direct.tesco.com/q/R.202-4135.aspx[/url])
for £99 which is less than the camera on its own! Can't imagine stock will last long.
EDIT: Use TDX-CLHD voucher for £5 off
Wow - that is a bargain ... but only if it's what you want. We have rarely printed photos and for the odd one or two photos it's cheap enough to send them to an online company for printing. Not being photographers, we will probably make our decision for all the wrong reasons but it seems that we're unlikely to be disappointed with any of the ones we've considered so far. If we end up buying online, I'll certainly need to search thoroughly for discount codes - www.myvouchercodes.co.uk seems to be a reasonable site. Quidco are great - I'm due to get £50 back from car insurance we got through them recently - not bad seeing as the quote was also just about the cheapest. I've just seen your link to CameraPriceBuster. Thanks.
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Shutter Lag Comparison (http://www.cameras.co.uk/html/shutter-lag-comparisons.cfm)
I shall be looking at this later - yet more data to throw into the decision making
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My decision list (no nominations!) is driven by the following thoughts:
1. Picture quality IS important, so the lens counts for more than the software.
2. "Electronic zoom" is only useful for examining picture details in-camera. It does nowt for the real picture. Optical zoom is a must - the more, the better (don't always have to use all of it).
3. I have bad (very bad) eyesight, so a viewfinder is not much help, a big screen shows me more.
4. Because I have to hold the camera away from my head (see above), it tends to shake more than being held against something solid (yes, my head!) - so "steadying software" is a big advantage.
5. More MP = more money but it depends on how/where the picture will be viewed: 5 MP gives good quality on a 19" screen or A4 sheet; anything bigger or cropped-and-filled needs more pixels.
6. Technology is improving exponentially - today's "state of the art" is tomorrow's "out of the Ark" - last season's cameras may be a bit cheaper but will lack so many features. SD cards have increased in capacity and prices have fallen through the floor ... you can get 8GB cards now for less than the original cost of a 256MB. (In a few weeks, that will be 128MB.)
7. Stick with the "known names" for cameras (Olympus, Nikon, Canon, Minolta, etc.) rather than film or technology manufacturers. They tend to know what is really necessary for photography, instead of wonderful sounding but trivial features.
That's my two-penn'orth, anyway. Hope it helps to whittle down the list of possibles.
Once you have a short list of two or three, go into Jessops (or wherever) and ask to hold your choices "for comparison" - you may well find that one camera "just feels right" (or very wrong) before you pay out those all important drink vouchers. (You don't have to buy in Jessops, say "thanks, I'll go and think about it" and buy the best deal you can.)
Good luck.
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... you can get 8GB cards now for less than the original cost of a 256MB. (In a few weeks, that will be 128MB.)
Yes it is scary how the price has dropped. When I bought my first digicam ( a Canon Pro 90IS (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/Canon/canon_pro90.asp) for over £700! ) I also bought a 128MB Compact Flash card for £72. For £72 now you could get approximately 32GB, so in effect the price has come down 250 times in about six years.
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Just been out to yet more camera/technology stores. Karen's warming to the Canon IXUS75 - a bit heavy but a good feel to it. Then we saw the Olympus FE290. It was a bit bulkier than others we'd looked at but was quite light. It seemed to tick the boxes in that it's got a x5 optical zoom, 3" screen and a lens that starts at 28mm f.l. (35mm equiv.). We sensibly held off buying but were pretty much decided on it. Then when we got home, we read the reviews ... distinct lack of features, image barrelling at wide angle, very noisy at the high ISO values, if you can call it that - ISO640 max. So we won't be buying it.
It's either the Canon IXUS75 (the 80 or better are too pricey) of possibly the Olympus C-560 (FE-340) which is on offer at Jessops at the moment. Just off to read more about it.
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Decision made (finally!). It'll be the Olympus FE-340 from Dabs (Play.com is cheaper but out of stock).
Thanks for the advice - Paul, Chas and John. My camera's just started playing up - intermittent bright horizontal lines in the image so I may well be going through all this again soon. I've just got to promise not to get a better camera than Karen's Olympus
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Decision made (finally!). It'll be the Olympus FE-340 from Dabs (Play.com is cheaper but out of stock).
Thanks for the advice - Paul, Chas and John. My camera's just started playing up - intermittent bright horizontal lines in the image so I may well be going through all this again soon. I've just got to promise not to get a better camera than Karen's Olympus
Phew! Always a relief when a decision is made
No experience of Olympus myself but it looks good and gets positive reviews.
I see Dabs are doing free delivery this weekend plus 3% Quidco or TopCashBack so the price is around the best in stock you can get.
I'm sure Karen will be very happy with her new toy
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Decision made (finally!). It'll be the Olympus FE-340 from Dabs (Play.com is cheaper but out of stock).
Thanks for the advice - Paul, Chas and John. My camera's just started playing up - intermittent bright horizontal lines in the image so I may well be going through all this again soon. I've just got to promise not to get a better camera than Karen's Olympus
Phew! Always a relief when a decision is made
No experience of Olympus myself but it looks good and gets positive reviews.
I see Dabs are doing free delivery this weekend plus 3% Quidco or TopCashBack so the price is around the best in stock you can get.
I'm sure Karen will be very happy with her new toy
I'm sure she will and seeing as she insisted I order it in pink there's every chance I'll stick to my camera
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I'm sure she will and seeing as she insisted I order it in pink there's every chance I'll stick to my camera
I wondered if she might! Now when yours packs up, you can get the blue model. His and hers
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Decision made (finally!). It'll be the Olympus FE-340 from Dabs (Play.com is cheaper but out of stock).
Just had a look at reviews on that camera. It looks more than excellent to me. Well worth all this discussion.
John R
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I'm a bit late for any real advice as the deal is done but my thoughts regarding viewfinders on cameras
i think they are essential ( unless like Chas and you cannot use them) the viewfinder option means you can hold the camera firmly against your face, reducing camera shake and letting you see the actual shot you are framing. i have seen so many people vaguely waving a camera at a view at arms length...
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I'm a bit late for any real advice as the deal is done but my thoughts regarding viewfinders on cameras
i think they are essential ( unless like Chas and you cannot use them) the viewfinder option means you can hold the camera firmly against your face, reducing camera shake and letting you see the actual shot you are framing. i have seen so many people vaguely waving a camera at a view at arms length...
Good point harribobs - it's also useful for long-sighted people like me who can't see anything on the screen without my glasses. Fortunately Karen's short sighted so she can see the screen even if she can't see the thng she's photographing
When I first got my camera (3 years ago) I used the viefinder quite a lot but I rarely use it now - I find it easier to frame the subject if I'm looking at the screen (even though it's only 3cm). Also, although the camera's nothing special (powershot A80) it's got a screen that tilts and swivels so you're not forced to hold it in front of your face. BTW - the deal isn't done yet. Dabs sent me an email to say it's not in stock so I could cancel ... but we won't.
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Good point harribobs - it's also useful for long-sighted people like me who can't see anything on the screen without my glasses. Fortunately Karen's short sighted so she can see the screen even if she can't see the thng she's photographing
When I first got my camera (3 years ago) I used the viefinder quite a lot but I rarely use it now - I find it easier to frame the subject if I'm looking at the screen (even though it's only 3cm). Also, although the camera's nothing special (powershot A80) it's got a screen that tilts and swivels so you're not forced to hold it in front of your face. BTW - the deal isn't done yet. Dabs sent me an email to say it's not in stock so I could cancel ... but we won't.
If Karen doesn't mind something a little bigger then Canon are offering cashback on some of their A series (Expires tonight though)
So you could get the A720 IS for £110 from Jessops (£30 cashback and £10 off using code). It is here. (http://www.jessops.com/Store/s66576/0/Canon-Powershot-A720IS-Digital-Camera/details.aspx)
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Thanks Ploppy but we'll stick to the pink Olympus. If it looks like Dabs won't be able to deliver before we go on holiday (18th April) we'll pop down to our local Jessops, making use of the voucher to get it (badged as a C-560 but identical) in silver for a few pounds more. Interestingly, Nectar estores gives you a 5% discount at Jessops and the web ordering system takes that plus the 10% voucher discount off the price making it as cheap as Dabs but the Nectar small print says you should not use it with any other voucher so we won't.